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Dating Again #2: Mr. Too Attached

Though I’m now seeing someone exclusively I thought I’d continue my series of posts on my dating experiences after my split with John. I started the series late last year with a post on Mr. Rebound. Today’s post is about the second major figure in my post-John dating life.

I had entered my experience with Mr. Rebound knowing that I wasn’t looking to date anyone seriously. A few months later though when I met Mr. Too Attached I was starting to feel that, in seeing someone, I could start considering something more serious. I wasn’t looking for a relationship but I was going to let myself be open to the possibility.

Like Mr. Rebound I met Mr. Too Attached through an online dating site. We traded some messages and decided to meet for a coffee date. My initial encounters with Mr. Too Attached went really well. He seemed really good on paper. In his early sixties he was handsome, educated, in a creative profession. He had also recently moved to the city and so we had a shared experience of feeling like we were starting over. I definitely saw dating potential in this man.

We soon had a second date, dinner out and after which he invited me to his place. It started innocently enough, but again it ended by getting far more physical than I should have allowed. I clearly didn’t heed my own warning after my experience with Mr. Rebound. However, this time it backfired not because of misplaced interest. Rather, it complicated the process of dating by creating a sense of seriousness or intimacy early on, making it more challenging to end the relationship when I realized he really wasn’t right for me.

In total we probably saw each other seven or eight times. At first it was all great, I enjoyed the time we spent together and learning about what he did and his personal history. Sadly, the interesting conversations wore thin pretty quickly and Mr. Too Attached was in constant contact. Soon everyday he was e-mailing and/or calling me without really saying much.  All conversations seemed to devolve into dry commentaries about our work day. I was still having an enjoyable enough time when we’d go out together, but I just didn’t feel the click.

clingySadly Mr. Too Attached was moving in the opposite direction. As I was beginning to feel “this guy would make a fine friend, but not a partner” he was starting feel that I was the one. Eventually, during one of our frequent phone conversations I had to tell him “look, I’m beginning to recognize that I’m not matching the level of intensity you’re feeling toward me.” Immediately afterward he was quite upset but then came back saying he wanted to see if we could still work, he promised that he’d mellow out and we’d just see how things developed naturally. I was willing to give this a try, I still saw some potential and didn’t want to pass up an opportunity. Unfortunately, Mr. Too Attached was just that.

I can’t quite figure out why Mr. Too Attached was so enthusiastic about me. I don’t have such an inflated view of myself to think it’s my devilish good looks and irresistibly charming personality. Perhaps, it was his own lack of a social circle in this new city. Maybe he was in love with the idea of being in-love. I don’t know, but I found, despite what romantic comedies seem to portray, being hotly pursued when the feeling isn’t mutual can be a huge turn-off.

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Dating Again #1: Mr. Rebound

When I met John I had been in the dating world only for a short time. After our relationship ended I found myself back in the dating pool. Since, I have found it a bit daunting to try dating again. I certainly know a lot more now than when I first really started dating older men six years ago, but I’m finding that I’m encountering more unusual and challenging experiences than I expected. This is the first post of a series reflecting on my experiences now that I’m dating again.

Shortly after the split I started frequenting one of the more popular intergenerational gay dating sites. Having just come out of a relationship I wasn’t looking for anything serious and even if I were I wouldn’t know what I was looking for. I just wanted to get out, try dating again, and hopefully have some fun times. On this website I started trading a few messages with the man I’m going to call Mr. Rebound.

Mr. Rebound was friendly, thoughtful, and a little bit shy. My own introverted nature led to some of the problems I had with John and it was refreshing to encounter someone that seemed to understand that part of my personality. After a couple of weeks of correspondences and chatting we agreed to meet for coffee one afternoon. The first meeting was rather uneventful. Mr. Rebound was unassuming and easy to be around. We sipped coffee and had rather general conversation. At that first meeting I found him attractive and was excited at the prospect of potentially being with him.

Mr. Rebound and I continued to have our online conversations, and early on he was well aware that I had just come out of a relationship. We commiserated together at how much of the world just doesn’t get the way introverts like us operate. A week or two after the first coffee date we met again for dinner.

To be honest, I don’t remember the dinner much. Afterwards he invited me to his place. We chatted more, listened to music, sat on his couch together and eventually began to make out. Mr. Rebound respected, or at least tried to respect, the fact that we really hadn’t known each other long and that I was fresh out of a relationship. I kept the momentum going however and we ended up in his bed. Again, he tried to slow things down but I thought I was ready to go for it. I threw caution to the wind and we ended up hot, sweaty, naked, and sticky.

I don’t think it was too long after that that I realized that I had made a mistake. I continued to see Mr. Rebound but we didn’t have sex again. It wasn’t that there was anything particularly wrong with him. But, while I didn’t realize it at the time, I was trying to fulfill competing desires with my relationship with Mr. Rebound. On one hand I wanted a friend to talk to, to decompress with, and to get thing off of my chest that had built up as my relationship with John fell apart. I hadn’t felt comfortable doing that with any of my existing friends. On the other hand, I wanted to fulfill sexual desires that weren’t being met. I discovered those two roles shouldn’t be fulfilled by one person, especially not during the emotionally stressful period I was experiencing at the time.

With Mr. Rebound I realized I wanted a friend more than I wanted a lover. Eventually, I was able to tell him this and to my surprise he wasn’t angry nor did he simply disappear after I made it clear I no longer wished to have a romantic relationship with him. We have continued to be friends, and though not terribly close we see each other fairly frequently to have walks, chats, coffee, etc.

Since then I think I’m still trying to learn lessons from this first post-John relationship. First, one must make a distinction between those they really wish to date and those they simply want something physical with. I should have learned that when dating someone that I may want to have a meaningful relationship with that I need to take it slow on the sexual front. I’m not sure I have fully learned that lesson, but that’s a story for a future blog post. By meaningful relationship I mean either long-term dating or simply friendship. To move quickly into sex complicates the getting to know you process and if you do determine you just want to be friends the sex could be deadly to the future of the friendship. I feel that I was pretty lucky to come away with a new friend in Mr. Rebound.

Guest Post: Discovering Self and Others

Today’s guest post is from GtD reader Carl of Tucson, AZ. I appreciate him sharing part of his story; it highlights how relationships evolve overtime and how that causes us to evolve over time ourselves.

Tom and I are a good twenty-seven years into our time together. Lovers, buddies, partners, friends, housemates, sharers-of-pets, we’ve come a good way along the path together. You know: house, cars, yardwork, repairs, illnesses, triumphs, successes, failures– we’ve weathered them both individually and as a unit. Heck, our house is nearly paid-for!

A few years ago, Fil entered our lives. Thirty-three years old, he offered a newness to our studied habituations. Way different and more easy-going than we, he was filled with jollity, laughter, copious amounts of wine and off-centeredness. Fil lived up to his name, filling gaps Tom and I hadn’t realized were present in our lives as individuals as well as a pair. Fil came and went. I understood. He’d had his own life to sort out; we, ours. Then, out of the blue, a few months ago, Fil re-emerged, re-connected with us. He’d moved, gone to North Carolina, come back, become a caregiver for his grandparents, continued laughing, imbibing, being loving and caring. He’d come over for dinner, a movie, a night of massages and health tips– whatever. I figured it was cupboard love. I was OK with that. Really, I was.

Not knowing “the rules” of the new landscape, Tom and I both held back, resorting to entertainment rather than home-iness. Just what was going on, anyway? Fil would have none of it. True to his nature, he steamrolled good-naturedly passed the bs, landing fully in the moment. Ah, youth!

Now, after a few months of renewal, Tom and I have made a place for standing dates for movies, “Fringe”, good food and laughter, and continued baby-steps to a triadic comfort zone, where three people, two generations, differing ethnicities and family backgrounds and disparate personal histories begin to mix and gel their three personalities– two of whom love and respond to youthful playfulness, and one of whom self-confesses, to our delight, that he likes “grandfatherly types”, which, I hope, means wisdom, patience, stability, longevity– into a more unified sense of what a relationship means: Trust, sharing, a sense of belonging while exploring individuality. Allowing and encouraging the other partner(s) to grow and blossom is the test of whether we, from our differing perspectives, can and will develop our lives into something greater than what the sum of the parts may be. We have entered another point on the continuum of possibilities in human relationships. I look forward to the exploration.

Jealousy: The Specter of Former Lovers

When relationships are new there tends to be a lot of uncertainty and insecurity.  One of the number one things that can spur on that insecurity are the former lovers of your partner.  This can be especially true for the younger partner in interegenerational relationships and for older men who have recently come out of the closet.  When these sorts of individuals enter a relationship it can mean there is a large differential between the number of lovers each person in the relationship has had.  Compounding this challenge is the fact that gay communities can often be small meaning that former lovers are still within your partner’s social scene or network; sometimes even remaining close friends.

When John and I first got together I found this sort of thing particularly challenging.  John was very open and honest about his past dating and sexual experiences.  While this was great in the sense that we could have a trusting, well communicated relationship, at times I felt like he was constantly revealing people he had dated or slept with. I had only had one previous lover while he had many.

One individual, Oscar, was especially challenging.  Oscar is a very attractive Latino man, a bit older than me, and very successful in his career.  Shortly after I met Oscar and his partner, John revealed to me that they had dated for a while some years before.  He even recounted an evening during which he gave Oscar a blow job while he lounged in John’s whirlpool tub.  This painted an indelible mental picture that still sticks in my mind today, and at the time I wasn’t sure how to process.  It was clear John was still attracted to Oscar. I couldn’t help but feel as though I was being compared to Oscar (and others) and I worried that I could lose him to one of these other men.

As I recount this story, I wish I could give easy solutions for getting over this sort of insecurity and anxiety, but I can’t.  John and I have now been together for over three years and those fears from the first year no longer nag at the back of my mind.  How did we stick through it?  I’m not completely sure.

To a certain extent I think it simply took time.  It took time for us to become fully comfortable with one another, to fully trust one another.  I think it also took coming to a point where we accepted the fact that we might be attracted to other people, but this didn’t mean we weren’t committed to one another.  And ultimately it took good communication and a willingness to talk about our pasts, our attractions, and our love for each other.  While that early level of openness on John’s part was a bit unnerving at the time, I think it helped me grow.  It helped me come to terms with my own sexuality and eventually helped me love John for exactly who he is, complicated past and all.

What have your experiences been with your partner’s former lovers?  Have you had bad experiences with these former lovers?  Good experiences?

Previous thoughts on anxieties in intergenerational  relationships.

Getting to Know You: pt. 2

Earlier this year I posted the first in a series of polls designed to help me get to know my audience better.  Getting to Know You: pt. 1 asked about your age, and it was interesting to see the breakdown of the ages of the visitors here.  I have posted a few other polls in the past, most ask questions about gay issues.  But, but this new series throws into that mix questions about you, my readers.  I encourage you to respond to all my posts with your questions, thoughts, and responses.  But if you’re uncomfortable with that I hope you’ll at least consider responding to these anonymous polls as they come along.  Ultimately, I hope this feedback will help me become a better blogger, better able to respond to issues that interest you.

Our second getting to know you poll is about sexual identity.

Please, feel free to leave further comments or expand on your response to today’s poll.  Also, below you can find links to other previous polls.  If you haven’t in the past, feel free to participate in or respond to them as well.

Questions on Infidelity

Coming Out Intergenerational

Would You Marry Your Partner

Greatest Age Difference With a Partner

Old Dogs, New Tricks

John and I have been together for two years now.  I’d like to think that we’ve moved into that phase we might call a “mature relationship”.  We’re very comfortable with each other, we usually know what to expect from each other from day to day, and we’ve passed the period where we need to be in each other’s presence 24/7.

There is something nice and reassuring about reaching that status in a relationship, but at the same time it can be a little frightening.  You wonder if you partner is as excited by you as he once was.  Are you stimulating enough for him, emotionally, mentally, sexually?  Or the same fears may arise about the relationship may crop up in the reverse, you might ask yourself whether this new “comfortable” phase is really what you want.  I have to admit that these questions have arisen in me from time to time.  Never in a soul-shaking sort of way, but as our relationship has evolved I’ve been self reflective.

Because of this I was particularly pleased today when John called me at work.  I asked him what he was up to this afternoon and he replied “I’ve been thinking about what you did to me last night”, referring to a new sexual position I initiated.  It excited and pleased me to think that even after two years there were times when I could get under my partner’s skin in a way that he’s still fantasizing about it the next day.

It’s surprising what a little change in routine or scenery can do for one’s sex life.  But, I wouldn’t credit our good sex life solely to sexual adventurism.  Openness about sexual desires and fantasies helped us be more trusting partners and have often provided fuel for our sexual fires, whether we act directly on those desires/fantasies or not.

Top Five Anxieties When Entering an Intergenerational Relationship

anxietyFor individuals entering any type of intimate relationship there is going to be some level of anxiety.  One is always concerned if the other party is going to like them.  However, for intergenerational couples these anxieties may come in the form of age or status related concerns.  Often these anxieties can be subliminal, not fully apparent to the individuals involved in the relationship.  By addressing these anxieties consciously, though, an individual can either move beyond them and let the relationship flourish, or identify incompatibilities that are irreconcilable and decide to move on.  Today I present to you five major points of anxiety for gay intergenerational couples.  I hope they serve as a starting point for self reflection for my readership as well as a conversation starter here at GtD.

Perception – Individuals within intergenerational couples are often concerned with the perceptions of others, particularly if they are entering their first age disparate relationship.  As I discussed in many of my early posts here, there are a number of stereotypes surrounding intergenerational couples.  This can lead to a lot of anxiety for those individuals, which can effect how they approach the relationship.  I remember fearing intensely the reactions of family and friends to the news that I had entered a relationship with someone much older than myself not to mention anxieties over the way strangers may treat us as well.  Outside societal pressure can definitely have negative impacts on ones relationship and until I came to the conclusion that I had to make my own decisions, I questioned what future John and I might have.

Opportunism – Both older partners and younger partners my have concerns that they are taken advantage of.  Is the younger partner simply using the older for financial gain?  Is the older with the younger merely for sexual reasons or for status within the gay community.  While the problem of opportunism can be a legitimate concern, and I would never encourage an individual to let themselves be taken advantage of, the charge of opportunism is a serious one and can be quite hurtful if not true.  Fully examine anxieties over opportunism, before acting upon them.

Performance – This is probably an anxiety felt more acutely by older men than younger men.  Incidence of decreased sexual function increases with age.  Some older men fixate on problems they may have with sexual function leading to anxiety about how that will effect the relationship or how the younger man may react.  To a lesser extent younger men may have some anxieties in this area, worried how they may measure up to previous partners in the love making department.

Autonomy – On the other hand anxieties over autonomy are more likely to touch the younger partner.  Older partners in intergenerational relationships are often more established financially and professionally, and may have a leg up in terms of their relationships with friends and family (i.e. how long they have been out and accepted by those groups).  For the younger individual this may pose a challenge to their independence and self authorship.  How do you cultivate a healthy relationship with someone that has already established their identity when you’re still working on yours?  At the same time the older partner may fear hindering their younger partner’s development, concerned they may hold the younger man back.

Rejection – Ultimately the anxiety we all share when we enter a new relationship is the fear of rejection.  The previous anxieties feed the fear of rejection as do other concerns.  The older man may fear that he not in good enough shape.  The younger man may fear that he’s not educated or experienced enough.  And because of these or other anxieties both parties ultimately have anxiety over rejection.  Early on every small argument and disagreement my feel like grounds for rejection.  Fortunately as time goes by, if all these anxieties are confronted and dealt with, that anxiety of rejection begins to fade and a stronger relationship is left in its place.